Subscribe to EDN

Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues

December 21, 2006

As if Nintendo didn’t have enough excitement with flying game controllers, conversations with Broadcom, supplier of the Bluetooth and WiFi chips in the Wii suggests that as use of the game console expands another serious issue will confront advanced users. This is once again a system design problem, but it should be laid at the feet not of Nintendo or Broadcom, but of the standards committees who formulated the Bluetooth and 802.11 specifications.

The problem is that when used simultaneously in close proximity the two radios interfere with each other. In theory this is absolutely not true: 802.11 uses a wide frequency band that should make it relatively insensitive to narrow-band interference, and Bluetooth—with Advanced Frequency Hopping (AFH) enabled, is supposed to gracefully move away from any frequency band with a high level of energy in it. Trouble is, the standards folks with their superb modeling skills apparently never actually tried this in the real world, with both radios in the same box. Bluetooth and WiFi don’t coexist well at all.

Unfortunately for Nintendo, the Wii system design relies on Bluetooth to transmit control information from the game controller to the console. Setting aside a very pertinent discussion over the wisdom of putting a Bluetooth link in a control loop, this means that when someone is playing a game, the Bluetooth radio is essentially always on. There is no downtime in which to perform time-division multiplexing with another radio.

That is only a problem if the Nintendo user is also moving a significant amount of data—a download, for instance—over the WiFi port. The yammering Bluetooth radio in the controller will cause serious interference with the WiFi signal, sharply reducing the effective data rate. Not a problem for the occasional packet, but quite noticeable, sources say, for file downloads, and a critical problem if future use models attempt to stream video over the WiFi port.

The designers have done pretty much everything possible under the respective radio standards to lessen the impact on users. The media access controllers behind the two radios negotiate with each other over a proprietary, Broadcom-designed bus, examining the packet queues and priorities, and attempting to create windows in the traffic for multiplexing. This requires some fairly sophisticated quality-of-service decisions, such as looking for natural gaps in speech so that lower-priority data or best-effort packets can be swept through.

The two radios also try to stay out of each other’s way in the frequency band. If the WiFi chip is on, the Bluetooth radio, which normally uses a center band in the Bluetooth spectrum, moves to outer bands, in effect spreading its spectrum a little. This seems to help. But if the Bluetooth radio turns on enhanced data rate 2.0, the power level goes up considerably, and the WiFi error rate becomes an issue again. Similarly if the WiFi radio is trying to carry streaming video—which along with game-control data and speech has top priority—there’s just not much room for negotiation.

Nintendo and Broadcom are looking for specific solutions. But there’s a larger issue here. If contention problems are hard to resolve within one vendor’s box, how is the digital living room every going to function? Some people in the industry are suggesting that there will have to be an industry-wide standard for quality-of-service negotiations between competing radios operating in different boxes in the same general area. This protocol would not only allow Bluetooth and WiFi radios in the same box—potentially on the same SoC—to both function, but would allow what today are nightmare scenarios for wireless designers, such as multiple Bluetooth links between devices and remotes, 802.11n WiFi, and several varieties of cellular handsets to all work simultaneously in the same small living room, with most of the boxes stacked in the same cabinet.

Reportedly discussions have begun between vendors, but at a very tentative level. And it’s not even clear yet that all these different radios physically can share the same spectrum successfully with anything short of enforced time-domain multiplexing. That could present huge political problems for the industry, or, alternatively, infuriating and unresolvable problems for consumers.

Posted by Ron Wilson on December 21, 2006 | Comments (16)

April 1, 2010
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
grand-gambler.com commented:

good story, all laid out on the shelves


March 27, 2010
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
Linksys Wireless Adaptor user commented:

Here's another one for ya...brought a Wii for Christmas, since then have been having major issues with my Linksys Wireless Adaptor, whereby it keeps dropping my wireless connection to router. Didn't make the connection until today, as generally when Wii isn't being used, we unplug it from the console. Today however we forgot to unplug it and I've had no issues with dropped connections all afternoon. Go figure!!! Any explenations from you techs out there??????


March 8, 2010
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
JoseffMrsz commented:

Wii News Blog


December 23, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
um commented:

WiFi uses 13 channels (in europe) but due to the nature of the beast you need a 3 channel seperation to avoid interference. This means there are only 3 non overlapping channels in reality. The problem with bluetooth is that it uses the complete spectrum taken up by wifi on the 2.4ghz spectrum. Therefore it will often cause interference with which ever channel you choose. Now nintendo can't just change the frequency they are using because that would be illegal (in uk anyway). So I guess there will be some problems, but they may be very limited in nature so not be a REAL problem. Another point. If you run a b/g mixed mode network it will slow down to 11mbps if a single b device connects. So if the wii only use b then all your g devices will slow down from 54 to 11mbps.


November 22, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
Yanni Donald commented:

This company stock (ROKE) is set to take off. Worldwide client base in the mobile communications space. See the details at www.icoft.com/roke.html


June 27, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
kalya commented:

this did not help me at all


May 28, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
coco commented:

I just bought a Wii and connected it to my network. Now my router repeatedly stops broadcasting the WIFI signal until reset. Anyone know what's up?


April 27, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
Speargun commented:

Aha! So this is why my upstairs radio becomes to filled with static when my son fires up the Wii in the morning -- just as I'm about to hear the traffic report.


January 28, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
chaingmairunner commented:

Wii pointer hand is often upside down making the controls entirely opposite, internet connection often disconnects. Does anyone know what the problem is? Should we trash our systems and go for a reliable system, or is there one?


January 28, 2008
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
sick much? commented:

Wifi can't make you sick... your skull is getting bombarded by stronger signals from sat radio, cordless phones, dds, cell phone towers, and so many other consumer radio signals in similar freq that if wifi from a wii (less that 100mw at the base) you'd be writhing in pain constantly. Go see a therapist - it's in your head or you're just doing it for attention, either way you need help and not from Nintendo.


September 13, 2007
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
kidswii commented:

Well, my wife went out and bought a Wii for my kids and I plugged it in last night. Within about 10 minutes of being 8 feet away from it I was quite ill with headaches, giddyness, lost concentration, and losing the ability to explain why to my wife and kids! I couldn't keep my train of thought, and got rather frustrated! I thought that the wireless setting may be enabled by default, but to my surprise it was actually disabled by default. This means that disabling the wi-fi does not turn it off or even reduce the power enough to make a difference. Even though putting the Wii into standby mode reduced the signal, it was by a tiny margin and still made me feel ill. In the end I had to leave the room and go and lie down while they played, and turned the Wii power off completely when I went back into the room. It took over 8 hrs for the pain to get better! I have sent another email to Nintendo in the US asking them to add an option to turn the wi-fi off, and hope they respond.


September 11, 2007
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
kidswii commented:

hi, thanks for your posts/info. As I get very ill when in close proximity to wifi cards and routers (inc' mobiles, and DECT phones) I've recently asked Nintendo UK Tech Supp if the Wii actually turns off the wireless, or just turns the power down to a low level when it is cleared from the config. eg. when you want ot use a wired Lan adapter instead. The answer was that they didn't know, although a few people had asked for the functionality when it was in testing prior to release! They are supposed to be passing the question onto the US to find out, but I've not heard anything more yet (1 week) If/when I hear I'll post the answer.


May 15, 2007
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
TREINAMK commented:

I THINK NINTENDO HAVE TO HELP US THIS KIND OF ISSUES, BEFORE CUSTOMERS STARTING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT IT. THERES A LOT OF MONEY INVOLVED.


January 8, 2007
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
hey hey hello commented:

ok this is what i say if you are havin' some problems then when updating unplug you blue touth that's it no if and's or but's about it


December 21, 2006
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
firsttimereader commented:

I cannot comment with technical competency, but I believe if the Wii has a wired connection, and the other two "connection settings" boxes are clear (i.e., the Wii is not looking for a wireless network, the only option among it's three is set to wired) that it *DOES* turn the WiFi off. My only evidence for this is that when I went wired this week (by using the unapproved 3rd party USB connector that the fan community has discovered works with the Wii, even though the official Nintendo adapter does not ship until January) the surface temp problem I was having with my Wii decreased considerably. I do not have Wi-Fi, but I do have the Nintendo Wi-Fi USB Connector, which connects to your PC and acts as a hotspot for Nintendo products (DS and Wii). That connector gets extremely warm (known issue), and requires you to turn certain firewalls off, so I only used it sparingly (when downloading a new game, or a system update). Even though the Wi-Fi Connector was out most of the time, as long as WiiConnect24 was turned on in my system, it was looking for a Wi-Fi connection and was very warm to the touch on one side (not enough to hurt my hand, but enough to concern me). Now that I have a wired adapter in the back, one side of my Wii is almost cool, and the left side that was extremely warm before now just simply is warm. There is a marked difference. Therefore, I theorize that indeed it does turn off the Wi-Fi when you are using the wired connection. Again, I am basing this on nothing more than the changes I noticed in my Wii - I am no expert by any means on wireless networks. I also deleted the Wi-Fi USB Connector from the menu, to ensure that my Wii would never look for it. The Wii now has the Wired connection in it's 1) slot, and 2) and 3) slots are empty. Hope this helps someone!


December 21, 2006
In response to: Nintendo Wii wireless problem illustrates RF communications issues
Mausmalone commented:

The real question becomes, then.... when you use the wired connection for the Wii, does the Wifi one turn off? If so, at least then there's some recourse for people who have issues with wireless signals. Beyond slow downloads, I haven't had any serious connection problems myself.

POST A COMMENT
Display Name
captcha

Before submitting this form, please type the characters displayed above. Note the letters are case sensitive:

Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
About EDN   |   Site Map   |   Contact Us   |   Subscription   |   RSS
© 2011 UBM Electronics. All rights reserved.
Use of this Web site is subject to its Terms of Use | Privacy Policy

Please visit these other UBM Canon sites

UBM Canon | Design News | Test & Measurement World | Packaging Digest | EDN | Qmed | Pharmalive | Appliance Magazine | Plastics Today | Powder Bulk Solids | Canon Trade Shows